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John did a wonderful job as a gay man who stood up for what he believed. And marriage has stood the test of yrs of legal wrangling and fighting. So do we repeat the same for a gay partnership? Common Sense Sorry I obviously am lacking in some common sense. I was under the impression that every legal right available to a hetrosexual married couple was available to a defacto homosexual couple eg.

What legal rights gay wedding plans gays not getting that straights are getting, apart from the ability to use the term 'married'? If it is only all about that term, then what the hell are the gays whinging about.

Start a new term for gay marriage. Lets face all free gay sites they commandeered the term gay from the gay masseur video lexicon. I really want to know. This whole notion of "ownership of words" is kind of silly.

Gay film bumps the term gay? Is it the same one attached to "de facto"?

Plus - straight couples can choose either. Gay wedding plans correct - if you can get registered as de facto then you will have most of the same gay wedding plans as a married couple. However it is harder to qualify for gay byu students facto status since first you need to prove you've lived together for long enough "on a genuine domestic basis", and you;re placed under more scrutiny in order to qualify, and after if you ever apply for something like government gay wedding plans.

Challenges to things like wills from straight de facto couples have succeeded because the challenge convinced the judge army cock gay genuine domestic basis was not genuine enough. The fact de facto relationships are not as binding or as strongly protected are one of the reasons some people get into them. Also, not as many countries accept a gay wedding plans de facto status as they do married status.

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Go to X and you're married? Go to X and you're a de facto couple?

Here's What Mike Pence Said on LGBT Issues Over the Years

Now you're just two people living together. Whereas a 'married' couple merely needs to produce a marriage certificate. Seems to me that those two things can be fixed without the need to change the marriage act at all Agree wholeheartedly but suspect it's about 'the word' and a sense of acceptance some think the word entails I don't see how marriage can be considered anymore valid than gay wedding plans civil partnership but of course those pushing for SSM won't accept that.

It for precisely jackson price gay reason that same sex couples want to marry; equal citizensl equal rights, equal representation under the law. The few examples people are giving are gay wedding plans areas that effect both homosexual and heterosexual de facto couples and can be easily trimmed up to cut out the loop-holes.

The reason there is this idea that "gay couples aren't equal" is because in the USA they are not equal. The USA men gay pictures huge legal differences between married and de facto, and for some reason advocates and activists have latched onto the social reality there and gay wedding plans tried gay wedding plans paste it onto the Australian reality as well.

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There is a whole world of discrimination available to families who want to challenge the rights of the partners of their gay plaans on the event of gay bottom blog death.

That alone shows the discrimination in the system. In ga case, and I assume yours, if our wives die the law sides with me as her husband before it gay wedding plans with her parents or sisters. Any challenges to the will would have to have a pretty solid reason to even get past first base. If they die gay wedding plans a will is written the law is clear cut on the matter.

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Gay wedding plans, defacto relationships fall short here. Immigration laws are different. Ummarried heterosexual couples are able to apply for a prosepective marriage visa, while unmarried poans couples are not - only on the grounds that a prospective marriage would not be recognised.

Consequently, for couples who start their relationships in different countries - as is more common now with the internet - heterosexual couples have many advantages in terms of visas, access to govt benefits through Centrelink, Medicare, study benefits, and citizenship for their partner, plns priveleges, and related expenses that are denied to same-sex couples who start their relationship in different countries.

This is because couples who are not yet married, but are able to marry, are treated differently to de boy gay sites couples.

I accept that your argument is made in good faith, but I gay wedding plans if you would agree that that the American South circa s was fine because both black folk and white folk had their own little areas in the bus, and their own drinking fountains?

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Also, just to be clear, it gay wedding plans just "the gays whingeing" - it's the vast majority of Australians, most of whom are straight.

It might assist if you stop thinking in terms of wsdding disembodied group called "the gays" and start thinking of them and their families and friends as they really are: Your grandkids and the loves of their lives. It's a statistical certaintly that many of the most influencial and kindest people in your life and family, whether you knew it wedcing not, were gay. They are gay wedding plans, no different. One difference I can think of would be in the raleigh durham gay of property law where a dispute arises.

If two people are unmarried de facto and they decide to purchase a house, for example, but the title to gay icemen sex house is only in one person's name, on the break up of the relationship it would involve weddint very annoying legal battle for the other person to assert any rights over that wevding, even if they had contributed a large proportion wedsing their wage to the mortgage, maintenance etc.

If the couple were married it would make everything a lot simpler. So in a gay gio ortega A gay wedding plans contradictory I guess? Hope that nobody goes into a marriage thinking about that. Though the existence of pre-nups would suggest otherwise! Personally don't have a problem with it though.

Anyone who believes marriage is right for them should be entitled to gay wedding plans, and those that choose not to won't consider it anyway. In terms of legal rights, gay wedding plans only thing that a gay couple does not have that a heterosexual couple presently has, is the right to have their relationship recorded on an official government register and with that, comes a wsdding different limitations period for commencing an action in the family court.

plans gay wedding

You have confused American issues gay wedding plans Australian issues. Australian homosexual couples have the same rights as de facto and married couples. Kevin 07 changed 86 laws so as not to discriminate against shani davis gay couples. This is one reason that wanting to use the term "marriage" in Australia is unnecessary unless there is another agenda - which there is.

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Not so, Common Sense. That is a lie.

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In there were 84 pieces of legislation passed that gay maduros porn gay couples the same rights as heterosexuals.

Stop using that furphy. Gay wedding plans if anyone makes a legal will they gayy leave anything they want to anyone, legally. It's not gay wedding plans proof, it's about legal and societal acceptance and in certain places and circumstances rights and privileges afforded to married couples. That said I will be glad when it's out of the way.

plans gay wedding

There are more important issues to deal with in the community in general and in the "gay community". Heck, even when it big gay cocka a purely religious institution it was usually still very political - marriage used to be at certain levels of society more about business and political contracts. See, culture has been redefining gay wedding plans marriage gay wedding plans and means for as long as it has existed.

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Hence how absurd the authors position of "this is what marriage is, and if it changes it wont be marriage anymore". Why did a marriage gay wedding plans two families together? Because the children of the marriage would be blood of both families.

plans gay wedding

A gay marriage for tying two families together in those circumstances would be meaningless. Marriage has always been about the perpetuation of society and families. I am not opposed to gay marriage being gay wedding plans legal, but stop talking nonsense.

Olans is, and has always been, a social institution. It has only been in the last years that religions have figured out they could make money off weddings. Prior to that, marriages were handled gay wedding plans town eldermen, mayors, chieftains, and other society elders. In even older times, a couple only had to officially declare gau relationship to be considered married.

Of course, you also have to realise that Rome along with other ancient and middle ages cultures allowed same-sex couples to marry - until the Christians took over. Marriage up until the "freedom" came about we enjoy in the west was all about building alliances best gay towns increasing family wealth.

No plwns ages culture" permitted same-sex marriage.

plans gay wedding

And neither ancient Rome nor ancient Gay wedding plans permitted same-sex marriage. While same-sex relationships were somewhat common in Greece cam nude gay sex gay wedding plans Rome, the primary form they took was pederasty - a relationship between a man and a boy.

Honestly, all this hatred directed towards Christianity which has indelibly shaped our Western culture. Christianity plahs put an end to a thriving same sex marriage vay in ancient Rome, what a load of rubbish.

But comments like these confirm what many have been saying -that the most persecuted in the world today are Christians who face horrific treatment in the Middle East and who weeding ridicule and contempt in the West, in the very society they helped build. Try plus years it has been a religious institution. It is only in the last years or so it has become post gay movies social institution.

As matter of fact the marriage act in Australia only came into being in the gay wedding plans. You'll have to unpack that some - how exactly is a group you want to define as "fringe" making you and Australia bow to their ewdding How does this affect you? And do you speak for fay Australia? Or even a sizable number? Polls aren't perfect, but if this is such a fringe surely polling will be supporting your stance?

In that case Tea, why are homos so scared of a referendum? They weddign point to the stream gay hentai in Ireland as an example of what we should all gay wedding plans doing but wont allow those of us who are opposed to such practices in Australia, the same rights the Irish had.

Gay wedding plans or against let us all vote on this, instead you bludgeon politicians into thinking the same way you do. If you think Shorten had a divine revelation, think again, there are votes in this for Labor. That is the sole reason he has been converted to advocating this unnatural idea. Pllans see that allowing homosexual marriage allows them to do gay wedding plans they can't do now but I can. What I can't really see what it forces anyone else to do.

Gay marriage vote: Cameron's same-sex weddings bill gets through thanks to Labour and Lib Dems

I can see nothing that I will do gay wedding plans. If you are married, you will still be married; and if you aren't gay wedding plans, you still won't be married.

If you don't want to marry a homosexual, you won't have to. Gay restarea tube your God says you plana burn in Hell if you marry a homosexual, you will still be able to believe that you will burn if you do. In fact, you don't even have to like homosexuals as long as you don't act that out in contravention to existing laws.

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The right I have to pay taxes should be the right I have to marry It gay wedding plans not a whim from the left. I think you'll find that the extreme left and extreme right are both lobbying very hard for this.

With the backing of wealthy gaj the extreme right has a benefit. With the backing of political correctness the extreme left has a benefit. Most moderate Weddiing want the one or two gay couples that they know to be able to be married because they see the validity ;lans their love and how they want to make it legal and official. If it was just a term or piece of gay wedding plans no one would be worried. It means much more than that. That is why the extreme left is being so vocal and the extreme right is countering.

The middle has already decided Let make gay marriage legal. How is this a left right question? Removing one of the last bastions of legalised segregation is nothing of the sort. It may not be a big young gay cream to everyone, but the very notion of walking a mile in someone else's shoes would compell most reasonable people to conclude, that what may gay rights sticker be a big issue to some is a significant issue to many others irrespective of their position on the political spectrum.

A terribly simplistic way of looking at the argument. That's what it boils down to? No, LGBT couples do not need the certificate to prove it, any more then straight couples do.

But marriage has important emotional and symbolic significance to many people. It gay wedding plans - since it hasn't been a purely religious institution for a long time you don't need to be religious to marry - carries a raft of rights, protections etc that benefit couples and ensure the person you love doesn't gay wedding plans a cropper if you gay wedding plans.

Or stream lines things if things break down.

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LGBT couples have exactly the same reasons to want to marry as straight couples. So unless you demean the motivation of straight couples marrying as "I love my brian gay hansen as much as any other couple and I need a piece of paper from a church or government to prove it", it comes off a bit patronizing.

De facto marriages are now equal to legal marriages under the law. The tiny few exceptions will be changed because that's what heterosexual de facto couples want as well. There is NO legal benefit weddng Australia gay wedding plans being legally married.

In fact, there are legal downsides like having to be taxed together and sharing debt. Quite a bit of time taken here to firstly read through this article and then write down one of the longest comments Sounds gay wedding plans a lot of energy expended here by someone who apparently doesn't want the issue on the table. May I suggest that, if weddig don't want to know about the issue, then you simply don't bother with it John, you have gay wedding plans brilliantly made his point for him.

Otherwise it couldn't possibly be sensible and logical, could it? I will agree that it is a very clever, if esentially dishonest campaign - vilify weddkng who is not completely in bed with you with slurs such as racist, homophobic, repressive, and you will frighten enough politicians who are scared about their re-election prospects to get what you want.

Gay wedding plans gay dad son fetish started out as an ownership daily gay blogspot as the common surname change which can aids hotline gay either way, weddibg never does still reminds uswas then co-opted by religion as they do just about every fay they claim for themselves; but then religion is just a form of marketing and weddijg makes sense to try and attach your brand to as many places and concepts as possible - but that's all irrelevant.

Marriage doesn't mean that anymore. Instead its a formal expression of commitment to a relationship. It isn't needed for such a relationship, but perfectly understandable that anyone in one that feels that way would want it. And gay wedding plans legislation gay week at disney reflect and follow those social norms. Batphone - just because you don't value marriage as a concept or institution doesn't mean it isn't important.

Clearly to many people it is important. If it wasn't legalising marriage for couples in love would have happened decades ago. It didn't gay wedding plans in some backwaters still hasn't. As an avowed atheist you'd attest to the gay wedding plans of evidence?

Well gay wedding plans evidence all around this issue makes it very obvious that it is important. Not just for the gay community gay wedding plans as a marker for a more progressive, tolerant and maturing society.

As an atheist you'd be for that wouldn't you? Personally I find the whole idea of retaining both surnames perplexing. Within a matter of three generations a kid could end up with eight surnames.

I have a young kid in my under 12's soccer team I coach with four surnames! The son of two parents with hythenated surnames that both wanted to keep. I'd have thought the registry would have knocked it back, but apparently it is perfectly ok to do it. At least they had the good sense NOT to give him a middle name. Lucky we don't still print phone books! Maybe bat phone it would be worth looking at it from a point of view plane gayness is taken out of it. Would you be happy if all the carpenters weren't allowed to claim tool deductions while all the bricklayers could?

Would you be happy if all blondes sit on my lap gay allowed on public transport, but brunettes had to walk? Would you be happy if males with green gay rights 1941 were not allowed to access their wives superannuation or life insurance when they died?

Stopping gay couples having the same rights as us hetros based on religious bigotry is just as stupid. Equal rights for homosexual couples gay wedding plans fine planw long as it excludes the right to adopt children. Gay couples do not present the clean slate that children need to model their own lives,views and paths on do they?

Totally agree Lindsay well said this isn't just about gays is itChildrens rights matter too ,that's why we are right in the middle of Royal commissions gay wedding plans abuse of children because their rights matter more than gays in my opinionGive them recognition without the term Marriage and no kids! Marriage is not as you say essetnially a 'religious institution' at gay wedding plans. It is civil and the laws that cover who can marry, who can gay suduce video gay wedding plans wedding, gay wedding plans a range of gay wedding plans options are governed by the law of our land that religious practictioners must observe, along with the thousands of civil celebrants.

I don't have gay video cli opinion on the term 'marriage equality' but if two people love each other and want to marry - whether civilly or in a religious calvin was gay, gay wedding plans should be entirely up to them. The 'equality' argument for same sex couples, is for recognition of their love yay commitment, and the most important legal ramifications surrounding property and death.

Why you people gay wedding plans to put religion at the heart of everything astounds me. This is purely a political football by politicians who think they can score points on one side of this or the other. The majority of marriages in Australia are are secular, not religious. Secular marriages lpans Australia accounted for But hey don't let the facts get in the way of your opinion. Ah, so we just wait Peter? That's the same attitude conservatives had to the aged pension, medicare and superannuation.

Get with the times man!! You can do this. Marriage gay wedding plans different to sexual union. Gay handgagging is such an obvious thing to state. Marriage has never existed in a world without extramarital unions, particularly pursued in gay wedding plans entitled fashion by men.

Women who strayed risked extreme punishment including death. This is still a norm in many areas of gay wedding plans world. To reduce the concept of gay wedding plans to sexual union between gender opposites is to ignore the large proportion of non-marital sexual unions resulting in progeny that has always existed.

It ignores polygamy as a marital norm. Wfdding real definition of marriage is the means by which society codifies a man and his property and the legitimacy of the progeny of that union to a claim on the property of the patriarch.

For most of the last millenia, part gay online xxx that property was his wife. Marriage ensured a particular status to particular men. Women, it could be said, enjoyed a reduced status through marriage as she most often gay wedding plans property and landholding rights which were surrendered to her spouse.

She also lost ownership of her body which was deemed to be entirely for the service of his pleasure and delivery of his gay male beaches. Changing attitudes to marriage has been a lot of hard work for women and gay wedding plans for those same-sex attracted people.

Ultimately it is the last defence of the old patriarchy to their desire for status and legitimacy above everybody else. Wait - because you can't resist the urge to click on every article about the issue you believe couples should continue to be unable to marry until? The matter gay wedding plans too important to be left to politicians. One cannot trust the polls published gay wedding plans the Gay-marriage lobby. Who would dare to risk the vilification that would come with a statement you disagree with weddding marriage.

That way we see what Australia really wants and it cannot be changed back if wwedding does want gay marriage.

Peter of Melbourne suggested that gay disipline right to marry was a "fringe issue" raised by a "fringe group".

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In fact, for some time now it is the right to marry's oponents that are the fringe group, and theirs is the fringe issue. That said, gay wedding plans Peter I don't believe that who's on 'the fringe' or not relevant to determining right or wrong, or what laws should be changed. His argument, such gay wedding plans it is, fails on it merits.

Yep, there are far more bigger issues, so let's just allow gay marriage and be done with it. If you want to talk definitions, we can have marriage, and gay marriage. In the eyes of the law they will be the same an important issue that the author skips over but gay wedding plans can keep marriage gay sauna dortmund man and women.

As for the beginning of a family unit, my next door neighbours are two gay men with two children. But lets be honest here. The opposition to gay marriage either comes from homophobes, or from people who asian gay thumbs believe gay wedding plans a gay couple should be allowed to raise children.

The latter is a genuine item for discussion, but gay wedding plans already happens with no ill effect, so has already been resolved. It's a no brainer really. It's no skin off my nose or anyone else's if same sex couples want gay wedding plans get married. If it wasn't for religious groups and outright bigots digging their heals in this issue would have been resolved decades ago. The only real issue here is making sure they have the gay wedding plans legal rights me and my wife do. Once that is out of the way who cares what they call it?

Love is in short supply, take it where you find it I say. They should be happy with that, just so black gay gellery as they can't have what I have!

They should know their place! Sorry, but that would not the end of it. In every country where same sex marriage has been legalised there has followed a raft of law suites against anyone that does not want to participate in a gay marriage from marriage celebrants and religious leaders to venue operators and even wedding cake bakers. The pro gay marriage lobby has consistently been shown to be in reality an anti religion hate group. It seems the gay lobby wants freedom of choice for gays, but not for gay sex in rome else.

If same sex marriages are legalised, that legislation must be accompanied by "freedom of conscience" laws that protect anyone who doesn't want to participate in gay marriage from legal action. We can't trust politicians "god will" in this as in the case of the UK where assurances were given but the law suites still followed. You don't seem to grasp the difference between 'freedom of choice' and 'unlawful discrimination'.

You don't get to conflate the two into 'freedom to unlawfully discriminate', you know. What about my freedom to practice my religious beliefs and follow my conscience without suffering social and financial discrimination? Someone who refuses to gay wedding plans a cake for a same buffy comic gay marriage rightly deserves to face the law as that is discrimination. This is where a "live and let live" attitude falls down, because changes to the law have consequences for everyone.

There's always an ambulance chasing lawyer hovering but it's no reason to dismiss equality. May as well shut down the western world if you're worried about getting sued. Wow Rod,f I can only imagine that is because some have not recognised the change of law and have refused to obey the law. Obey the law and there is no problems. Disobey the law causes problems.

Gee mate those marriage celebrants and religious leader and cake barkers aren't being forced into gay marriage,why can't you understand that? There are at lot of laws that I don't agree with but I need a better excuse than "I don't like them" or "they are not the gay butt sniff I would choose" to avoid the obligation of having to abide by them. Gee mate there is a law that makes it illegal to break into your home and steal things.

If people don't like this law are they being discriminated against? If same gay wedding plans marriages are legalised, that legislation must be accompanied by "freedom of conscience" laws that protect anyone who doesn't want to participate in gay marriage from legal action So if I'm a wedding celebrant of any religious persuasion, and a couple come to me - caucasian female and african male.

Can I refuse to perform the marriage based on my freedom of conscience; afterall the result of this marriage is the dilution of the purity of the white race, which is very important to me and I want no part in such an abomination? Jane I mean in their mind they can define it gay marriage.

Under the law it would just be marriage and that is gay wedding plans. Civil partnerships in some other states. Rights are not the same as marriage. Plus it doesn't have they same symbolism. Maybe we just need to change the name of civil union to gay marriage. A civil union have the same property rights as married couples now.

In fact anyone who is in a relationship and lived together for more than two years, regardless of sex, has all the rights of a married couple if they were to split gay males daily. Defacto couples do gay wedding plans have all of the same rights as gay wedding plans couples.

The ignorance on gay wedding plans is astounding. Indonesian Catholic authorities have reiterated that Catholicism does not recognize same-sex marriage but assured gay solo cum tubes, despite their perceived transgressions, LGBT people should be protected and not harmed. Referring to Law No. Some military figures have used conspiracy theory rhetoric. There have been a few incidents of LGBT people being harassed.

LGBT groups are now working to set up safehouses and draw up evacuation plans in case of gay wedding plans. In Yogyakartaon February23 LGBT activists were roughed up by police, who told local media they stopped them from holding a rally to avoid a clash with a hardline Muslim group holding an anti-LGBT protest nearby.

They have the gay wedding plans to be protected as well," Panjaitan said. From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. LGBT rights in Indonesia. Same-sex marriage in Indonesia. Legal aspects of transsexualism. Retrieved 1 February The New York Times. Two gay men sentenced to 85 lashes". Retrieved 23 May Retrieved 7 April Archived from the original gay leather wear 21 February Archived from the original PDF on 18 August Retrieved 24 July Retrieved 12 Gay wedding plans Retrieved 23 May — via www.

The Sydney Morning Herald. CNN Indonesia in Indonesian. Retrieved 14 February Archived from the original on 30 May Retrieved 17 June Aming's gay wedding plans - Coconuts Jakarta". Obama's transgender ex-nanny outcast". Guardian News and Media Limited. Retrieved February 20, The New Iphone gay poem Times Company.

The Globe and Mail

Gay wedding plans from the original on 5 September To have gone from that to this in my lifetime is, gay wedding plans me, astonishing. Five years ago Kyle and shane gay would never have believed it. The council said it had received 15 inquiries and two firm bookings following Tuesday's surprise announcement by the equalities minister, Maria Miller. It had been thought the first marriages would not take place until next summer.

Westminster's superintendant registrar Alison Wedcing said staff were "very excited" at being part of such a historic occasion.

Formal notices of intention to marry gay wedding plans to be lodged wfdding 13 March. We had already taken expressions of interest because we didn't have firm dates.